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Message Board > Pattern Modifications, Design Changes & Pattern Drafting > Armhole too High?

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Armhole too High?
Terri Smith
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Terri Smith  Friend of PR
Intermediate
CA USA
Member since 9/16/04
Posts: 96
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Date: 3/28/06 12:16 PM

Hello,

I am making Hot Patterns Plain & Simple T Shirt, Size 12 Glamour Girl because my bust size is a 36, but I wear a D cup. The pattern measures for a 38 bust, so I took one inch out of the center of the pattern immediately. I made the pattern up according to Sandra Betzina's instructions and the reviews I got from DrSue and Tarheelsewer. Here is a pic of my first try:
Mock 1 a
and:
Mock 1 b

It seems to me that the armhole is too small, or high. There is a dart forming from the armhol towards the apex of my bust. And the top feels a little snug under the arm, like there is something under my arm that is not supposed to be there.

So, I think to myself, I can just cut out the bottom of the armhole on the front and back, about 1/2 inch each, of the top and then again on the sleeve. I do this, and discuss it with my DD who has never sewn a thing in her life, but can do calculus! She mentions that the cylinder of the sleeve is now going to be shorter than the opening in the top, so I added 1/2 inch to the sleeve at the bottom of the bell curve. This is what it looks like on try two:
Mock 1 b
And:
Mock 2 a

In my opinion, it is worse! the back of the sleeve is baggy--too long, and the front seems to have too much fabric--which makes me ask:

Is the first try bad enough to mess with?

Can I just take a 2/8 inch seem allowance instead of the 3/8 to make the sleeve a little wider, thus giving me more space between my armpit and the sleeve?

I plan to use a bright and busy buttermilk from EOS for my "keeper."

Any comments, suggestions, advice is greatly appreciated as I have scanned and read all of my sewing books and none of them seem to address the too high armhole, only the too low.

Terri
-- Edited on 3/28/06 12:29 PM --

Deb Fox
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Deb Fox
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FL USA
Member since 8/26/05
Posts: 1210
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Date: 3/28/06 2:31 PM

The dart, or fold you are experiencing means that there is a dart needed there. I had the same thing. I slashed and removed a dart from armseye to bust apex and added it to the side seam and just eased it in. (See FFRP). Clear as mud? What the folds are basically telling you is that you need some shaping to go over and around a curved part of your body. It also looks like you need to raise your sleeve cap. Both of these are adjustments that I did on my P&S T.

------
Deb: www.thinkingcouture.blogspot.com

Deb Fox
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Deb Fox
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FL USA
Member since 8/26/05
Posts: 1210
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Date: 3/28/06 2:32 PM

Sorry, forgot to mention. I also took 3/4 of an inch out of the center back, and moved the shoulder seams back about 5/8 of an inch. It seems that HP shoulder are to far forward for me.

------
Deb: www.thinkingcouture.blogspot.com

Elona
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Elona  Friend of PR
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Date: 3/28/06 4:19 PM

Two things, Terri:

At first glance, it looks to me as though that shoulder seam needs to be moved towards the front again. At least from the angle the picture was taken, you seem to have a definite forward shoulder thing going on, and it looks as though the shoulder seam wants to go forward at least the 3/4" you moved it back.

Second, there may be something interesting about the way you hold your shoulders, maybe both square (or high) and forward?

Could we see a photo of your front and back, showing neck and shoulders to below armpit level?

Terri Smith
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Terri Smith  Friend of PR
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Date: 3/28/06 5:42 PM

Pictures I can handle. Moving the shoulder forward again--I am confused.

As a note: On Mock 1 I realized that the back of the tshirt was gaping, so I lowered (squared) the shoulder slope on the neck side 1/4 inch on the front and back. This shows up on Mock 2.

However, what seems to be going on is that the armhole is probably okay, but I have other issues

I have no idea what an FFRP is, how to raise a sleeve cap, and how to move my shoulder seams one way or the other!

Again, thanks and here is my link to my photo album. You can look at all the pictures and get an idea of what is going on with my posture.
HP Tshirt

Terri Smith
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Terri Smith  Friend of PR
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Date: 3/28/06 6:14 PM

BTW, I just did a search for the FFRP (Fit for Real People) and found one on Ebay (from a seller in the UK). I bid on it, and hopefully will get it. Here is the USA, used FFRP's are going for $60 plus. Wow!

I found some info on the sleeve cap in Shirtmaking by David Page Coffin. I realize this is for shirts, but since I know nothing about this stuff, I will read it and at least have a little clue as to what is going on

Thank you for helping

Trinity.
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Trinity.
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Date: 3/28/06 6:59 PM

Newarkdress.com has this book for $25.00.

Denver Fabric is carrying it for $17.50.

The shipping for Denver is more than for Newark dress ($8 vs. $6) but it works out being less expensive from denver anyway. I like the notions newark dress carries so it was worth it to me to get it from there. I just received it last week, so this is current.

NAYY, just a happy customer.
-- Edited on 3/28/06 7:05 PM --

------
Trinity

http://thimblesthreadsandneedles.blogspot.com/

Linda F
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Linda  F
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Date: 3/28/06 7:03 PM

I am going out on a limb making these suggestions.

From looking at photo #11, I would say that you need a slight rounded back adjustment per examples I have seen in the FFRP book. This may stop the gaping in the back, and the way it the front hits your front neck, and possibly might get rid of that wrinkle in the front once the top is properly sitting off the shoulders after that adjustment.

Possibly by immediately taking out the amount you did in the front, you took out precious bust space and now you need to do a FBA to get more room for the bust area. That is what I am reading the wrinkles as saying what they need.

I think your thought process of the armhole is off right now, but I have not made this top. I am only going by the photos and the FFRP book.

If the rounded shoulder adjustment does not get the pattern to sit correctly on the body, then you may need to move those shoulder seams forward. This is done by adding to the back and removing from the front the same amount on each piece.

So I would do this in the this order using the FFRP book.
1. Rounded shoulder adjustment
Check fit.
2. FBA
check fit.
3. Move the shoulder seam
check fit.
But I don't know if you need to do only one of the above or all three. But definitely check out the section on rounded back.

Hopefully others will join in here.
HTH,
Linda

Gus2

Gus2
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Date: 3/28/06 7:15 PM

I'd remove the sleeves and work on the bodice only. After you have achieved a good fit then work on the sleeve. From the picture your shoulder seam seems to be too short. Put your finger on the top of your arm and see if you can locate
that "hinge" that your arm hangs from. That is where the 5/8 seam allowance starts.

------
Gus2

Terri Smith
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Terri Smith  Friend of PR
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Posts: 96
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In reply to Trinity.


Date: 3/28/06 7:34 PM

Thank you so much for the info. I was secretly hoping not to get the bid on ebay because I would have to wait and I was not buying locally (USA). I must admit, I did not do a search for the book anywhere except Amazon, Barnes & Noble, and ebay. Thank you again, I will check it out and probably purchase it right away.

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