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You don't see them in ready to wear. (Moderated by Deepika, Sharon1952)
Posted on: 7/29/06 7:51 AM ET
I'm a new sewer making my first tailored jacket from Vogue's Very Easy line of patterns. The pattern includes sleeve darts at the elbow.
When I made my test garment I included the sleeve darts, and they made the sleeve look homemade. I went through my wardrobe, and none of my ready to wear jackets have sleeve darts. When I sewed my real jacket, I left the darts out, and the sleeves looked so much more professional.
I've looked at other jacket patterns, and many of them also have sleeve darts. Why do pattern companies include them? After all, elbows don't have bustlines.
Are these darts just a leftover habit from the ancient days of pattern making? I guess they serve a purpose on wedding gowns with very fitted sleeves. But sleeves on today's jackets aren't fitted, they're fairly loose.
To me, a sleeve dart says the jacket was made at home by an amateur. And while I'm extremely proud of my new sewing skills, I want my clothes to look professionally made, not homemade.
I'm very curious? What do you do when you sew a pattern that has sleeve darts? Do you take them out, or do you include them? Do you think they add anything to the fit or design of the sleeve, or do you think they're an unnecessary detail? Please let us know.
-- Edited on 7/30/06 5:08 PM --
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When I made my test garment I included the sleeve darts, and they made the sleeve look homemade. I went through my wardrobe, and none of my ready to wear jackets have sleeve darts. When I sewed my real jacket, I left the darts out, and the sleeves looked so much more professional.
I've looked at other jacket patterns, and many of them also have sleeve darts. Why do pattern companies include them? After all, elbows don't have bustlines.
Are these darts just a leftover habit from the ancient days of pattern making? I guess they serve a purpose on wedding gowns with very fitted sleeves. But sleeves on today's jackets aren't fitted, they're fairly loose.
To me, a sleeve dart says the jacket was made at home by an amateur. And while I'm extremely proud of my new sewing skills, I want my clothes to look professionally made, not homemade.
I'm very curious? What do you do when you sew a pattern that has sleeve darts? Do you take them out, or do you include them? Do you think they add anything to the fit or design of the sleeve, or do you think they're an unnecessary detail? Please let us know.
-- Edited on 7/30/06 5:08 PM --
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No sewing project is ever a complete success nor a total failure.
Posted on: 7/29/06 8:15 AM ET
In reply to nancy2001
I always use the sleeve dart if my pattern has one. This is a nice design detail that really adds to the fit of the sleeve. I have moved from thinking that I want my garments to look like RTW, to thinking that I want them to look better than RTW. These little details make the sewing more enjoyable to me.
Posted on: 7/29/06 8:56 AM ET
Any fitted well tailored jacket will have a sleeve dart. You may not recognize it as such because most jackets now have two piece sleeves where the dart is disguised.
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Marilyn
January 2009 to January 2010 81 yards out and 71yards in January 2010 to the present 106.7 yards out and 146.5 yards in. January 2011 to the present: 47 yards out and 69 yards in.
January 2009 to January 2010 81 yards out and 71yards in January 2010 to the present 106.7 yards out and 146.5 yards in. January 2011 to the present: 47 yards out and 69 yards in.
Posted on: 7/29/06 9:18 AM ET
In reply to nancy2001
IMHO the sleeve elbow dart gives the sleeve a more natural shape.
A one-piece sleeve with no dart will hang stick-straight but our arms rarely hang that way when we stand at ease.
They're also easier to alter & sew than a two-piece sleeve (which gives the most natural arm shape.)
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A one-piece sleeve with no dart will hang stick-straight but our arms rarely hang that way when we stand at ease.
They're also easier to alter & sew than a two-piece sleeve (which gives the most natural arm shape.)
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iPad's auto-correct is my enema.
Posted on: 7/29/06 10:18 AM ET
Thank you all so much for your information. From now on I will look for patterns with a two piece sleeve.
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No sewing project is ever a complete success nor a total failure.
Posted on: 7/29/06 3:16 PM ET
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-- Edited on 7/24/10 8:24 AM --
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-- Edited on 7/24/10 8:24 AM --
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From what others have said, the nasty message came from Fitting Woes, NOT Misc Hot Topics or the Civility thread.
Posted on: 7/29/06 4:48 PM ET
In reply to nancy2001
RTW darts would end up at all different places on different wearers' elbows. When we custom make our jackets we make sure the dart is at the right level. It's one thing to rehem a sleeve, near impossible to move a dart.
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Buy the best and you only cry once.
Posted on: 7/30/06 2:55 PM ET
In reply to nancy2001
I always thought the opposite, that a better sleeve had darts and the cheap ones didn't....I get a little feeling of glee when I see one in there, thinking, oh, this is a good pattern...they took the time to put it in....
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"What you WANT is irrelevant, what you've CHOSEN is at hand." --Mr. Spock
Posted on: 7/30/06 7:20 PM ET
In reply to SansSouci572
I agree that a better fit is had with a darted sleeve ... unless it truely is an oversized fit such as the 80s.
A well pressed dart that is in the right place on your arm doesn't look home made, it will look natural. One in the wrong place or that hasn't been pressed might do.
RTW isn't always the best representation of quality garments. I like to have my clothes constructed better than RTW even if I don't aim for couture level.
RTW can have badly placed buttons - or even with one top I bought years ago, the 2nd from top button was an inch out of place, so it sat very oddly, and was why it was reduced. Seam finishes can be inappropriate or even badly done. Skimp on sleeve width to save on fabric. Layout the fabric off grain too much, also to save on fabric.
Not all RTW, but even at prices that you would expect quality construction.
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A well pressed dart that is in the right place on your arm doesn't look home made, it will look natural. One in the wrong place or that hasn't been pressed might do.
RTW isn't always the best representation of quality garments. I like to have my clothes constructed better than RTW even if I don't aim for couture level.
RTW can have badly placed buttons - or even with one top I bought years ago, the 2nd from top button was an inch out of place, so it sat very oddly, and was why it was reduced. Seam finishes can be inappropriate or even badly done. Skimp on sleeve width to save on fabric. Layout the fabric off grain too much, also to save on fabric.
Not all RTW, but even at prices that you would expect quality construction.
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Sydney, Australia
Posted on: 7/31/06 6:27 AM ET
When I worked outside the home, I was very particular about the clothes I bought. Although I didn't sew, my mother and grandmother did. They told me what to look for -- straight stitching, fabric quality, pattern matching and fit. I shopped at stores like Saks and took everything to the tailor. My clothes cost a small fortune, but I was always well dressed.
Now that I've started sewing clothes, I'm aiming for the same level of quality. Though I'm a beginner, I've worked hard, and I've made real progress. I can make knitted tee shirts that look nice enough to have come from the stores I used to shop at. My next goals are to sew a simple tailored jacket and a well fitting pair of pants I can feel proud of. One day I hope I'm good enough to sew everything I wear.
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Now that I've started sewing clothes, I'm aiming for the same level of quality. Though I'm a beginner, I've worked hard, and I've made real progress. I can make knitted tee shirts that look nice enough to have come from the stores I used to shop at. My next goals are to sew a simple tailored jacket and a well fitting pair of pants I can feel proud of. One day I hope I'm good enough to sew everything I wear.
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No sewing project is ever a complete success nor a total failure.
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