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Member since 1/24/07
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Posted on: 12/22/09 12:40 PM ET
If I measure my crotch width using the L-shaped cardboard or right angled ruler, how do I translate that measurement to the pattern? I don't think that the pictures shown in this tip are correct. If I match the inseams for about four inches and then measure at the hipline I think I get the correct measurement. I have not trimmed the pattern so the matching lines do not show properly.


.Photobucket' target='_blank'>measuring pattern
measuring crotch width

-- Edited on 12/22/09 1:02 PM -- measuring at hipline
-- Edited on 12/22/09 1:05 PM --
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Elaine
  
Member since 7/11/06
Posts: 926
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Posted on: 12/22/09 1:00 PM ET
hmm. To measure the width or "body space" needed for a pair of trousers or pants, you would typically need a flexible ruler or a piece of rolled up aluminium foil. Make it conform to your body from the middle of your waistline, between your legs and up to your waistline again over your bottom.

How does it compare with your pattern? Do you have to add or subtract from the with/body space accorded in the pattern?




-- Edited on 12/22/09 1:05 PM --
-- Edited on 12/22/09 1:06 PM --
  
Member since 1/24/07
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Posted on: 12/22/09 1:13 PM ET
In reply to Vibekeinyork
I have tried the flexible ruler, but it was a bit too flexible. I could never get it to hold its shape. When I tried to use what I thought was the correct shape, I was never sure where it should be lined up with the pattern. Should the pattern be placed as shown in the picture or should it be overlapped at ther inner seams? The reason that I showed it joined at the inner seams and measured at the hipline is that was the place where my meassurement with the cardboard L's and the pattern matched fairly closely. I have the feeling that, even though I might get the crotch depth and length correct, if I don't get the width measured properly the pants will not hang correctly.
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Elaine
  
Member since 7/11/06
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Posted on: 12/22/09 2:01 PM ET
Well, you must make a muslin, I suppose. Or use a pair of RTW and go from there.

If you use carboard squares, you will measure only the widest part of the width. Trying something more flexible will hopefully give you a more accurate model of your own shape.

Not sure what you mean by overlap the pattern pieces. Do you mean to correct for your body being less wide than the space allocated for in the pattern?
  
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Posted on: 12/22/09 2:14 PM ET
In reply to Vibekeinyork
Quote:
Not sure what you mean by overlap the pattern pieces. Do you mean to correct for your body being less wide than the space allocated for in the pattern?

what I meant was that I matched the inner leg seam allowances for about four inches rather than have the front and back pattern pieces facing each other as shown in the diagram.
I am hesitant to make a muslin at this stage because I will not know whether any problems that show up are a result of too little width in the crotch area. I don't want the legs to be too big. I do not need any more width for the thighs. How can you tell if the crotch width is too big or too small? Is it just a process of elimination? I think I read in one of the posting on these boards that someone starts with the crotch and works from there. If you don't know the proper crotch width how can you start? Perhaps I should be posting this in the fitting area.
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Elaine
  
Member since 7/11/06
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Posted on: 12/22/09 3:10 PM ET
In reply to Elaine Dougan
I see. You basically eliminate the seam allowances integral to your pattern pieces to get a more accurate idea of the space.

If I were you, I would start by tissue fitting the size that corresponds to my hip size. If the seat of your pant usually feels either too loose or too tight you might like to add or subtract a bit from the body space/crotch width even before you tissue fit.

It you want to preserve the amoount of fabrics that go around your body, you must add or subract correspondingly at the side seams. What I would do in that case is cut the leg patterns horizontally at the crotch level and sliiide them eiter way. Then true up.

(Except that I personally need to add both for my booty and inner thigh so I do it differently).
  
Member since 5/19/06
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Posted on: 12/22/09 3:21 PM ET
When you use a flexible ruler or a roll of aluminum foil, you need to mark where your center is. This is so you can orient the curve you make, which conforms to your body shape, to the pattern in the right places. Place a string or make a mark on the ruler or foil where the pants inseams/center front and center back seams should intersect when you are wearing the pants. If you use a flexible ruler that is too short for the crotch curve you need, focus on getting the back of the curve to fit first. It is easy to add to the front where you can see how much you need without contortions. The foil method means you can make as long a foil piece as your body requires.

When you put this on your pattern, the inside of this curve represents the *seamline* you need. Overlap the inseams of the front and back pattern pieces, matching the seamlines of the top several inches of the inseam. If you draw over the seamline of the pattern for front and back, that seamline is where the inside curve of the ruler or foil curve should lie when you put it on your pattern. The mark you've used for your body's center goes on the on the junction point of the pattern where the inseam and front/back crotch seamlines all intersect. Now you can see where you need to cut out or add to make the crotch of the pattern pieces fit you. If you have to carve out much, you will need to add the same amount at that level to the side seams or the amount of fabric covering you from side to side on a close-fitted garment will not be enough to cover you comfortably.

I hope that isn't confusing. I don't have the ability to post a picture of a drawing. My computer skills haven't gotten that far yet.
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Fictionfan
  
Member since 8/28/08
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Posted on: 12/22/09 4:14 PM ET
In reply to Elaine Dougan
Crotch width is also known as depth of body, and is a negative space as someone mentioned. I have read what I could on this, and not all books contain this info.

How to lay the pattern to measure this is a good question. Donald McCunn in How to Make Sewing Patterns shows to have the seamlines touching at the crotch points and at the hem. Hmmm. By the way, he calls this measurement "leg width". Other sources say to lay the pattern on straight of grain and have only the crotch points touch.

If you match the inseams for a few inches, you get a larger reading at the point you are measuring, but is it the accurate measurement you are looking for? I'm not positive but I would guess not. For example, if someone had very thin legs, then the spread would be even wider.

IMO if you match only the inseam points, the pattern will tell you if it is wide enough for your body. If it is not, then you would either need to extend the point or points until you get the correct measurement, or trim away the centers, depending on where you need it.

As others have mentioned, try fitting the paper pattern as well as possible, then make a muslin. It may not be perfect, but it will be a start. Pants are not difficult to sew, but a real pain to fit. When you get a pattern to fit, make a hundred pairs immediately.
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Oops, forgot what I was going to put here.
  
Member since 1/24/07
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Posted on: 12/22/09 5:28 PM ET
I found this diagram . Belinda's (Sew4Fun) diagram at pg 221 in this thread (Sewing Down Under).
Sew4Fun's diagram

She explains that you have to match the in seams to determine the curve. I still don't trust my flexible curve measure, but this is very interesting.

I copied her explanation here.
This diagram is all very rough and not 100% accurate, but it should give you the idea. The one on the left is a flat buttocks. The one on the right is a sway back/ larger buttocks.

The distance from the your back to the straight line (CB wedge) must match the distance from the straight line to the CB seam on the pants pattern. This determines how slanted your CB seam will be. The flatter your buttocks the straighter the CB seam.

The larger the CB wedge (buttocks) the larger the CB slant The fabric is cut more on the bias (more stretch to go over the larger buttocks) and the greater the "dart" in the CB seam. There is also more width/ fabric over the lower buttocks. If I measured just above crotch level there is more fabric width wise to go over a larger buttcheek. This is how the buttcheek part comes into the equation.

The curved part at the bottom of the crotch curve is the only part which needs to match your crotch shape. The place where your crotch shape curves inwards is the point where the curved part of the crotch curve stops and the straight line of the CF or CB seam starts.

It does get more complex but this is your starting point for your basic pants block. This is also a very quick summary so I hope I did it justice. I'm not an expert on this and only passing on what someone taught me. I do know it worked and gave me the answer I needed when all these other methods of molding your crotch shape didn't.

-- Edited on 12/22/09 5:31 PM --
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Elaine
  
Member since 7/11/06
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Posted on: 12/22/09 5:42 PM ET
In reply to Elaine Dougan
Yes, that makes sense. A very good explanation.
  
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