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want to understand it better (Moderated by Deepika, EleanorSews)
Posted on: 10/9/08 9:20 AM ET
Well, my son has a great job and is highly regarded but his job is evolving into doing some limited but necessary public speaking. He is required to give a short speech next month. Last time, he orchestrated a way to get out of doing it but still not sacrifice the quality of the presentation that he was a part of. He became physically ill--he describes it as heart in your throat, nauseous, shaky, light-headed and has even talked with his managers that he prefers not to do public speaking. They were supportive and kind but in reality he is still expected to take on some of this. I suggested seeing a doctor for an anti-anxiety med but this is so severe that he will probably change jobs if it continues. He said himself he would rather over-come it bc he knows already what he will say and it'd be great but he just can't do it. is this called a social phobia? just what causes it? i'd like some insights from those of you who know about it and some advice. was I off-base by suggesting meds (xanax in particular)? He has done presentations before with success but it seems to make a huge difference if he "knows" the people or not. i have the same problem and never EVER would be able to get up front and my dad who was successful in his field and DID have to make speeches hated it also. could this be an inherited genetic type thing?
Posted on: 10/9/08 9:42 AM ET
In reply to sewfrequent
Well... I'm not terribly sure if I can be of much help, as I have no trouble with public speaking. I'm a teacher by training, and competed in speech contests as a teenager (I once ran for lieutenant governor at girls state, and delivered a campaign speech in front of several hundred girls, and I was dreadfully nervous then - shaky voice, weak knees, knotted stomach, the works - but that was the only incidence of true nerves that I've experienced with it), and I can tell you that not having a fear of public speaking is really, really useful. My husband, on the other hand, is relatively shy, and can give presentations if he has to, but gets quite nervous, especially when not knowing the folks he talking to.
Anyway, fear of public speaking is something like the #1 fear that most people admit to, so your family is far from alone. It might actually be a true phobia in your son's case. I believe there are therapies that help - even a great deal - that combine medications with behavior modification (ie, gradually exposing the person to more and more folks, etc).
My understanding is that medication alone (especially) or behavior mod alone is not nearly as effective as a combination. of both. I personally would not recommend medication alone, unless he was going to be doing a LOT of speeches in the next year or so, so that he's being forced to do it a great deal (one of the best ways to overcome a fear is to do it LOTS).
On the other hand, if he's only going to deliver one speech every year or so, then maybe it makes the most sense to do meds alone - Is it worth the time and effort and money to go through the therapy for such a rare event? I'm not sure.
Either way, your son should talk first to his regular doctor, and then to a therapist who deals with such things. For what it's worth, regular doctors have a terrible tendency to hand someone a prescription and then not do the necessary followups. A psychiatrist I talked to HATES it when regular doctors prescribe meds like that, as he felt they weren't really qualified, and that too often the meds didn't help, because of the way the patient was handled by the GP. Either way, I'd highly recommend seeing your regular doctor and then getting a referral to a therapist.
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Anyway, fear of public speaking is something like the #1 fear that most people admit to, so your family is far from alone. It might actually be a true phobia in your son's case. I believe there are therapies that help - even a great deal - that combine medications with behavior modification (ie, gradually exposing the person to more and more folks, etc).
My understanding is that medication alone (especially) or behavior mod alone is not nearly as effective as a combination. of both. I personally would not recommend medication alone, unless he was going to be doing a LOT of speeches in the next year or so, so that he's being forced to do it a great deal (one of the best ways to overcome a fear is to do it LOTS).
On the other hand, if he's only going to deliver one speech every year or so, then maybe it makes the most sense to do meds alone - Is it worth the time and effort and money to go through the therapy for such a rare event? I'm not sure.
Either way, your son should talk first to his regular doctor, and then to a therapist who deals with such things. For what it's worth, regular doctors have a terrible tendency to hand someone a prescription and then not do the necessary followups. A psychiatrist I talked to HATES it when regular doctors prescribe meds like that, as he felt they weren't really qualified, and that too often the meds didn't help, because of the way the patient was handled by the GP. Either way, I'd highly recommend seeing your regular doctor and then getting a referral to a therapist.
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My (mostly) green sewing blog: http://NapkinLady.blogspot.com/
Posted on: 10/9/08 10:08 AM ET
In reply to CathyWeeks
Cathy, thanks for your advice. I'm going to suggest a shrink that way he can get counsel AND meds in one spot. The nice thing about xanax is that you can use it on an "as-needed" basis so for him this might be 3-4 times a year for the large groups. he seems to do ok with the smaller groups where he knows some or all of the folks. Thing is i know xanax is very addictive and i'm not sure if there are anti-anxiety meds that can work as well without that potential (probably not). he's a stable sort so i don't really fear him developing an addiction to it but i think most docs steer pretty clear of that particular one. This can be very immobilizing and i'm just not sure what the fear actually IS--maybe a fear of failure?
Posted on: 10/9/08 10:13 AM ET
I've had a number of profs admit to intense fear of public speaking and when people who give lectures for a living freak out about it, you know your son isn't alone!
As one who's aiming towards the prof world herself, my biggest tip towards comfort with it is to take baby steps until public speaking is, if not comfortable (it probably won't ever be easy), at least bearable. If he's part of a church then offering to read the announcements or a Sunday school prayer is public speaking in a comfortable, familiar environment. Volunteer to call numbers at a senior center's bingo night. Read to children at a library (and if you can do that, adults are easy!). Put up a video blog. Join a book club. Yes, they all take time but they're all worth it.
If baby steps are too intimidating then it's definitely time to talk to an expert. Phobias are par for the course for all of us (you should see my big, brawny DH sprint from spiders), it's just getting them to the levels where they don't interfere with life. Been there, done that with thunderstorms and it took a lot of work to get to this point! I'm still working on it with heights. Baby steps!
ETA: Glad to see baby steps are already in progress as he's ok with smaller groups. I don't know if it helps, but smaller groups are almost always more critical and attentive than large groups so, really, unless he does something really crazy then the crowd probably won't remember him. And if he does something crazy then he'll be the star of the night so he wins both ways. That is, at least, how I've always thought of it and it does help - big crowds of staring eyes are intimidating!
I have found that practicing in the hall where the speech is to be given is another way to get used to the big space and odd echos. If the exact hall isn't available then another large space also works. Just expect strange looks from the janitors. :)
-- Edited on 10/9/08 10:18 AM --
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As one who's aiming towards the prof world herself, my biggest tip towards comfort with it is to take baby steps until public speaking is, if not comfortable (it probably won't ever be easy), at least bearable. If he's part of a church then offering to read the announcements or a Sunday school prayer is public speaking in a comfortable, familiar environment. Volunteer to call numbers at a senior center's bingo night. Read to children at a library (and if you can do that, adults are easy!). Put up a video blog. Join a book club. Yes, they all take time but they're all worth it.
If baby steps are too intimidating then it's definitely time to talk to an expert. Phobias are par for the course for all of us (you should see my big, brawny DH sprint from spiders), it's just getting them to the levels where they don't interfere with life. Been there, done that with thunderstorms and it took a lot of work to get to this point! I'm still working on it with heights. Baby steps!
ETA: Glad to see baby steps are already in progress as he's ok with smaller groups. I don't know if it helps, but smaller groups are almost always more critical and attentive than large groups so, really, unless he does something really crazy then the crowd probably won't remember him. And if he does something crazy then he'll be the star of the night so he wins both ways. That is, at least, how I've always thought of it and it does help - big crowds of staring eyes are intimidating!
I have found that practicing in the hall where the speech is to be given is another way to get used to the big space and odd echos. If the exact hall isn't available then another large space also works. Just expect strange looks from the janitors. :)
-- Edited on 10/9/08 10:18 AM --
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Kit
"Never underestimate the power of the right dress!" - drsue
"Hyu gots to know how to sveet tok de costumers, dollink" - Girl Genius, 11-24-08
"Never underestimate the power of the right dress!" - drsue
"Hyu gots to know how to sveet tok de costumers, dollink" - Girl Genius, 11-24-08
Posted on: 10/9/08 10:14 AM ET
In reply to sewfrequent
Quote: sewfrequent
Thing is i know xanax is very addictive and i'm not sure if there are anti-anxiety meds that can work as well without that potential (probably not).
Thing is i know xanax is very addictive and i'm not sure if there are anti-anxiety meds that can work as well without that potential (probably not).
He could always try KavaKava. You can find it in health-food stores or places like WholeFoods markets. It is supposed to help you relax without the synthetics or addictive properties of Xanax.
A side note...jsut make sure to ask your pharmicist before taking, as it could interact with medications.
Larri
Posted on: 10/9/08 10:17 AM ET
Deleted redundant post.
Em
-- Edited on 10/19/08 2:53 PM --
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Em
-- Edited on 10/19/08 2:53 PM --
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From what others have said, the nasty message came from Fitting Woes, NOT Misc Hot Topics or the Civility thread.
Posted on: 10/9/08 10:23 AM ET
I've done all kinds of speaking, from teaching to formal interpreting at events, and still dislike microphones, but...how you cope often depends on whether or not you think that not going ahead with it is an option! I had to jump in at the deep end, otherwise I might have talked myself out of it too.
After doing quite a lot of formal speaking, I taught for over 10 years, and spent a sleepless night EVERY semester before meeting EVERY new class. Often the panicky feelings subside once you are really underway with your speaking, so feeling sick and shakey isn't necessarily a sign that you aren't going to make it through your presentation.
Those sick and shaky feelings are extremely common, even for seasoned performers and speakers, and they are just part of your body trying to get you ready to make a huge effort.
You can take medication, but really, that's going to affect all of you for your whole day, not just your speaking.
Honestly, there are all kind of good speakers. The suave and the hearty-party are not the only types of speaker that people want to hear - a slightly hesitant but well-informed and sincere speaker often gains more goodwill. My shy techie son sounds very like your son, he's not alone!
I try to imagine the worst that could happen. And really, it just adds up to a bad half-hour. And after all, it never is quite as bad as you think it's going to be, so it can only go better than you're imagining it will!
It is worth getting some help - a singing teacher would be useful if a speaking/drama coach isn't available, both for the performance anxiety, and for the techniques of voice and breath control. Speech therapists can even help people overcome bad stutters long enough to give a speech, through breath control etc., so there are practical skills that can be learned and used.
For myself, I find that I keep breathing in when nervous, and find I can't speak because I'm all choked up with a lungful of stale air. When you practice a speech, mark where to breathe, and where to breathe OUT. If you panic so much that you can't read your notes, write them out so that you have only one phrase per line (a bit like writing freeform poetry). That also helps with breathlessness.
If looking at a room full of strangers is distressing, just look a little above their heads - changing the heads you are looking above from time to time, so you don't look like a statue.
After doing quite a lot of formal speaking, I taught for over 10 years, and spent a sleepless night EVERY semester before meeting EVERY new class. Often the panicky feelings subside once you are really underway with your speaking, so feeling sick and shakey isn't necessarily a sign that you aren't going to make it through your presentation.
Those sick and shaky feelings are extremely common, even for seasoned performers and speakers, and they are just part of your body trying to get you ready to make a huge effort.
You can take medication, but really, that's going to affect all of you for your whole day, not just your speaking.
Honestly, there are all kind of good speakers. The suave and the hearty-party are not the only types of speaker that people want to hear - a slightly hesitant but well-informed and sincere speaker often gains more goodwill. My shy techie son sounds very like your son, he's not alone!
I try to imagine the worst that could happen. And really, it just adds up to a bad half-hour. And after all, it never is quite as bad as you think it's going to be, so it can only go better than you're imagining it will!
It is worth getting some help - a singing teacher would be useful if a speaking/drama coach isn't available, both for the performance anxiety, and for the techniques of voice and breath control. Speech therapists can even help people overcome bad stutters long enough to give a speech, through breath control etc., so there are practical skills that can be learned and used.
For myself, I find that I keep breathing in when nervous, and find I can't speak because I'm all choked up with a lungful of stale air. When you practice a speech, mark where to breathe, and where to breathe OUT. If you panic so much that you can't read your notes, write them out so that you have only one phrase per line (a bit like writing freeform poetry). That also helps with breathlessness.
If looking at a room full of strangers is distressing, just look a little above their heads - changing the heads you are looking above from time to time, so you don't look like a statue.
Posted on: 10/9/08 10:47 AM ET
Is there a Toastmasters chapter nearby? They are a great resource for overcoming the fear of speaking publicly:
Toastmasters International
Toastmasters International
Posted on: 10/9/08 11:12 AM ET
I've done a lot of public speaking, though mostly to smaller groups. Once after I had been away from it for awhile, I was driving to the event and was sure I was coming down with the flu. My hands were shaky, stomach flipping etc. I freaked out a bit because I knew the talk would be harder to give if I was fighting off one of those super aggressive bugs. After a couple of minutes of wrangling with that mentally, I finally realized I was nervous! There was a total mind/body disconnect going on. Pretty weird. Once I recognized what was going on, I actually felt better.
So the moral of the story is - practice, practice, practice!
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So the moral of the story is - practice, practice, practice!
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http://bgballroom.wordpress.com to follow the progress on my next ballgown.
Posted on: 10/9/08 11:45 AM ET
I vote for Toastmasters too, or take a speech class that involves intensive speech making. The feelings are normal and I don't think need to be medicated. He just needs practice and as much of it as he can get. It's really about learning to organize your thoughts and delivering the speech. He needs to learn to create an outline and to be able to speak extensively from it.
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Marilyn
January 2009 to January 2010 81 yards out and 71yards in January 2010 to the present 106.7 yards out and 146.5 yards in. January 2011 to the present: 47 yards out and 69 yards in.
January 2009 to January 2010 81 yards out and 71yards in January 2010 to the present 106.7 yards out and 146.5 yards in. January 2011 to the present: 47 yards out and 69 yards in.
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